How does this show that Jupiter is the Fundament?
It doesn’t explicitly say that Jupiter is Fundament, like I said in a few replies up, if this theory is correct, they may not want us to know about it yet, so obviously there is no blatant claim that Jupiter is Fundament. But it certainly is significant that the first time humanity discovered the traveler, it was orbiting Jupiter. There are plenty of clues scattered to make this claim. Why Jupiter? What if our discovery of the Traveler and the Creation of the Hive happened simultaneously?
I’m still not sold on this. It seems like it is possible, and maybe even probable, but I still think that it’s not quite right. Main reason I think this is because of how far apart time wise it is. Oryx was around for thousands to millions of years and the Traveler has only been in our system for hundreds or thousands of years. If you can find anything to prove me wrong, please do. I really want to see what you guys can find to support your theory.
My only thing I can say to refute your argument, is that time may be irrelevant in this scenario. Like I said a few replies above, relativity is a thing in the real world and we have the Awoken as a prime example of relativity in the game’s world. What if the hive’s throne worlds stretched time just like the Awoken’s home world, The Distributary, does. Millions of years in a pocket universe such as a throne world, could be fractions of time in our real world.
That could be true, but they also didn’t have throne worlds for a while after they became the Hive we know today. There’s also the problem which baxter touched upon,
If the Worm Gods were at the center of Jupiter, and they knew of the Traveler and what it was doing, why didn’t they send them to destroy it, and by extension, us?
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I’m with you on this. I’m not sold. I feel that is we were in the same solar system as the hive they would have wiped us out way before we had any chance to threaten their existence. They likely would just leave us alone, especially when they were on their great rampage killing everyone. I do think that Fundament is a planet Like Jupiter, but it is not Jupiter. Also, as the hive were tearing through the moons one of those civilisations likely would have contacted us for help. I just think that we would have gotten involved in the massive war.
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However who says the hive fighting would have reached earth this early? Also even if messages were sent to humans we probably wouldn’t have noticed
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A message from a civilization as advanced as the Ammonites would have been impossible to miss.
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Regardless of the time it took, the series of events does not work at all. The Traveler did not arrive at Jupiter and then flee as described in the BoS. It proceeded to move around our system and terraform planets and moons. None of this behavior is evidenced in the BoS.
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I definitely think the hive would have attacked us without any hesitation. We would be such large amount of people that is very vulnerable. It would be such a large amount of death to feed them that they wouldn’t pass it up. We would have been be free food.
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True, also we don’t know what communication the ammonites used so we might have been sent a message but didn’t receive or understand it
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But we do have evidence of an intelligent civilization on IO, that no one seems to have an explanation for or records of. How did humanity miss that? Why are there no records of the bones on IO? There are too many blurred lines to discredit this theory and the coincidence that both species mentioned on IO and in the BoS are both Ammonites is a little overwhelming for me to omit this theory as a possibility. Timeline really doesn’t mean much to me, especially calling back that the vex are also stationed on IO in the pyramidian, home of Brakion, GENESIS Mind. Why is it called genesis mind? What if the vex are responsible for the manipulation of time?
While that is possible, I find it extremely unlikely. A type 3 civilization facing an extinction event from an alien threat with knowledge of another civilization that was also threatened would have no problem sending an alert/request for help that would be understood and received as such.
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Regardless of being right or wrong, I do find that a lot of the evidence has contradiction, but I do like what debate is unfolding because of it. I’m sure there’s more that both sides could dig up and find, but wouldn’t it be interesting if the hive were born right under our noses?
Maybe Jupiter was a base for when bungie came up with the idea of the fundament
The ammonites might not speak the same language as us
Another mystery that we do not know is how the hive arrived on Fundament. From what I’ve heard mostly is that the Osmioum court were not native to Fundament, but seemed to have crashed there.
We also know that the events in the BoS may not even be true:
“Go out into the universe, my court
Gather tribute for me. Send it home to my ship.
When I call you, walk up that tribute to my court.
I will prepare for long voyages — [I am Savathûn, insidious]
Into the war — [I graffiti this notice for you]
Into the Deep — [These Books are full of lies!]”
This throws a stick into the spokes of both sides of this argument, however my end still has evidence of an Ammonite civilization in both cases.
I think you are getting the BoS confused with Truth to Power. Truth to Power is the only book we cannot trust implicitly.